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    Age of Empires II Medieval Monday: Ask Your Questions and Get Your Answers

    August 17, 2020

    Age of Empires II Medieval Monday: Ask Your Questions and Get Your Answers

    Medieval Monday: Ask Your Questions and Get Your Answers

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 08:07 AM PDT

    Time for another weekly round of questions.

    Talk about everything from build orders to advanced strategies.

    Whatever your questions, the community is here to answer them.

    So ask away!

    submitted by /u/AutoModerator
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    I am the definition of cancer

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 12:04 AM PDT

    When my allies say they need resources

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 08:40 PM PDT

    Pathing Test DE vs AoC

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 02:41 AM PDT

    Pathing Test DE vs AoC

    Hey guys (and girls), I made identical Scenarios for DE and AoC(UP 1.5) in which I test the pathing in several tests

    The test starts with simply tasking 4 Villagers to the goal (King on Ice), through a maze where our Scout blocks the way

    One manual test is the 4 Monk test. Simply select the 4 monks and tasks them to the opposite Jungle Tree, after all 4 monks don't have the "stop" symbol, task them back to the other Jungle tree, the results are truly not what you would expect.

    All other 3 tests are automatic and start once the stone wall is destroyed. We have 2 Patrol tests with a group of Tarkan's and one with ranged Unit + melee units of different speeds

    The last test is simply tasking 2 villagers to collect wood from a tree which is only accessable by one tile.

    Disclaimer:

    Even though most of the tests are done by triggers, the scenarios are not consistent, as pathing is not consistent. You might load the same scenarios twice and get 2 different results. Also the AoC AI sometimes resigns when it has nothing left but the scout cavalry at the corner.

    AoEzone post

    Results:

    First of all, I would kindly ask for any Youtuber or people that are familiar with video editing (anyone) to run the 2 scenarios side by side (if possible) or one test after another (Test 1 DE, Test 1 AoC, Test 2 DE etc.) and upload a video on YT. This would really show the results more perfectly.

    Lets move on

    First test

    The first test is really just a simple go from A to B test with a maze and a scout as obstacle

    DE:

    2 Villager makes it to the set Location, while the 2 other bug in the scout and stand still. One of the villager also doesn't walk the fastest way to the location but eventually, find its way.

    AoC:

    All Villager make it to the set Location, The majority of Villager (3) just walk through the scout as if it doesnt exist (In DE only one does that), the last one is equal to the last one in DE, while walking in the wrong direction, in my tests he was able to correct himself sometimes early than in DE, sometimes they went the same. In AoC the Villagers move less smooth and are stuttering at the start to turn from a 2x2 villager grid to a 1x4 (as the path is only 1 tile wide).

    Second test:

    The monk test is one of my favourites. It checks how the pathfinding reacts when units are tasked to locations that are occupied or cannot be reached. I stumbled upon this test when I tried to test the conversion resistant of 4 different units (scout, light cav, hussar, generic knight) but I digress.

    DE:

    In DE they stutter, not all monks make to the closest tile, but most of the time they do.

    AoC:

    In AoC the situation doesn't get better, both versions struggle to compute the right pathfinding. In my tests AoC was able to move all 4 monks more consistently but way slower as they stutter earlier. Nonetheless, its performance is catastrophic and both Versions fail massively

    Third test:

    The third test consists of a patrol test. A group of Elite Tarkans are patrolling to into a building which has a building next to it laying down a trail of buildings to destroy

    DE:

    In DE you can see that the game uses the waypoint system to command the units. If you select all Tarkans you can see the flags it sets from building to building (Should you see the flags?) and the Tarkans do a great job, often also stacking by themselves. After all buildings are razed, the Game simply lets them patrol from the starting point to the patrol point, as intended

    AoC:

    In AoC several weird things happen. First of all the units dont stack and patrol as usual if they dont have enough space to attack the house, but some units appear to bug out and just stand in a line while not moving. After destroying all buildings, the tarkans patrol in an for me not understandable way, by just patrolling in front of the last building razed, while one tarkan stands still at the starting point.

    Fourth test:

    The fourth test is also a patrol test, this time its a mix of different units (2 Teutonic knights, 2 plumed archers, a regular archer, and a mangudai) are tasked to patrol to the King on the Ice. 4 immobile Longswordsman are in the way.

    DE:

    The Definite Edition does an great job and executes what you would expect. When the Longswordman, who can only be hit by ranged units, showed up, the archers took them down while the TTK's went on patrolling back and forth, after the archers were done killing, they joined the TTK's.

    AoC:

    Same as DE, however in some instances the TTK's bugged out at the king and stood still, the archers did the same.

    Fifth test:

    2 Villagers are tasked to cut a tree that is only accessible by one tile. While you might think this is simply, it's by far the weirdest one, on AoC.

    DE:

    In DE it was apparently coded that villagers are really using the closest way to the tree, following the edge of the nearest tile and standing on the left outer edge of the tree that gets cut, allowing the second villager to chop on the outer right. Both Villagers are working, DE passed.

    AoC:

    Now, this is one of the weirdest unexpected results I have ever seen. In AoC the villagers try to chop trees in the middle, clogging up the whole tile and not allowing the second villager to share this tree. However, if you task the first villager to move to the outer edge manually, both can chop, but we don't interfere. So, instead of the second villager taking a nearby tree as it cannot access the intial tree, it simply walks 50 tiles and cuts a bamboo on the other side of the map. Wow 11.

    ​

    Conclusion:

    Both pathings are not ideal, DE has improved Patrol in my tests. Although DE did well in those tests, I find DE to have more pathing errors in practical situations (Military often cannot decide what to attack next and go back and forth between 2 buildings instead of choosing one of them).

    I also found bugs which never happened to me in AoC, and I have 800 games on Voobly and 100+ games on DE. I already reported 3 of them in the forums (except that bug that Villager stop working sometimes).

    Also, Foot Archers have slightly higher range in DE.

    ​

    In DE the Plumed Archer and the regular Archer can attack the outpost, while in AoC they can't. Mangudai can attack the outpost in both.

    Should in the DE version any archer attack the outpost stop them move them to the starting position and put them on stand ground. I would have done this with trigger but you can only put them on passive stands (the Trigger from AoC with Userpatch that can give them any stand ground doesnt work in DE)

    ​

    Download Scenarios:

    The DE scenario is the AoC scenario where I exchanged the .scx to an .aoe2scenario.

    DE Version

    AoC Version

    ​

    If you have any problems comment here

    submitted by /u/Deathcounter0
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    Seriously! Dont let them get to imp

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 07:50 AM PDT

    Sorry guys I'm not very good at team games, or 1v1 for that matter

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 03:03 PM PDT

    The Vooman

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 12:57 AM PDT

    Yes you are reading to play ranked - ELO adjusts so you play with others your skill

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 07:15 PM PDT

    Go out and have fun! If you win, that's awesome! If you lose, you can learn and it's no big deal. Everyone has been there :)

    Mods pls pin

    submitted by /u/Tyre77
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    Thoughts on including "twitch.tv" in in game user names? Relatively new to playing/streaming and wondering if it comes across too self promotey, especially at my level of play which can be observed in the clip below.

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 03:52 AM PDT

    Capoch just qualified for Wololo II after coming back 4 months ago

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 02:18 PM PDT

    He reverse sweeped Vivi/FatDragon 4-3.

    Some stats to fuel the discussion:

    - Before the Clown Cup Qualifiers (early July 2020) his last Liquipedia entry was Global Gaming League in 2004, where he placed 5-6th (DauT was 2nd btw).

    - He is currently ranked 21 at aoe-elo.com, and his best account is ranked 17th in the official ladder.

    And now he is one of the 16 players at the Wololo II tournament.

    What do you guys think? What is his ceiling? Is he a future top 5 or is he peaking now?

    Anyone know when was the last S-tier 1v1 tournament Argentina had two players?

    submitted by /u/wontreadterms
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    This is fine.

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 08:08 AM PDT

    Recently joined this sub and learned the term and strategy "douche" -- I never knew about it growing up so I just tried it out on the AI and had a lot of fun. 10/10 Would douche again.

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 02:01 PM PDT

    Beating MESSO Civ’s!!!

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 05:21 AM PDT

    I want to ask the community for some HELP, please.

    Can someone explain to me how to beat the Messo Civ's, in particular the Mayan's. Everyone I come up against them it seems that my opponent goes early MAA, then trans into masses of Eagles. How the bloody hell Do you beat that.

    Archers - To slow and get SHREDDED when a mass of eagles hits them.

    Pikemen - To slow and get shredded.

    MAA - Hold their on to an extent but again are just To slow.

    Knights - Sort of decent on mass but even these guys struggle to keep up.

    Siege just doesn't work.

    So short of walking up, keeping gold in reserve and waiting him out, what can I do???

    Is it just a case of getting in first with a huge Feudal push???

    Any help is greatly appreciated.

    Cheers people.

    submitted by /u/AussieTodd2609
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    Which civilization do you think is the strongest for Cavalry Archers?

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 12:43 AM PDT

    Which civilization do you think is the strongest for Cavalry Archers?

    Which civilization do you think has the strongest Cavalry Archers? This does not include unique unit CA such as Mangudai or Kipchak. Feel free to leave a comment defending your choice, or let me know if I missed any note-worthy civs for CAs.

    Some notes:

    Britons - do not have Thumb Ring, Parthian Tactics, Bloodlines

    Cumans - do not have Bracer, Husbandry

    Huns - do not have Ring Archer Armor

    Mongols - do not have Ring Archer Armor

    Vietnamese - do not have Parthian Tactics

    https://aoe2techtree.net/#Britons

    Vote Button Poll Options Current Vote Count
    Vote Britons (Archery Ranges work 20% faster - baseline) 1 Votes
    Vote Cumans (CA trained 50% faster - Castle Age UT) 2 Votes
    Vote Huns (CA are 10% cheaper in Castle; 20% cheaper in Imp - baseline) 11 Votes
    Vote Magyars (CA +1 range, +1 attack - Imp Age UT) 50 Votes
    Vote Mongols (CA fire 20% faster - baseline) 11 Votes
    Vote Tatars (Thumb Ring, Parthian Tactics free; CA +2 LOS; units deal +25% elevation damage - baseline) 14 Votes
    Vote Turks (CA +20 hp - Castle Age UT) 8 Votes
    Vote Vietnamese (Archery Range units +20% hp - baseline) 0 Votes

    Instructions:

    • Click Vote to Register Your Vote.

    Note: Vote Count in this post will be updated real time with new data.

    Make Your Own Poll Here redditpoll.com.

    See live vote count here

    submitted by /u/JW357
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    2v2 Team Battlegrounds

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 07:25 AM PDT

    Hey everyone we at hosting a New Team Game Tournament

    Make sure to register by August 21st! register alone and we will put you in a team or register together with your teammate

    And just to sweeten the fact we are putting on a new tournament we have raised a prize pool of $200 USD

    Register here https://docs.google.com/document/d/1o4dXSHJURfc5mzAYVHhHdlH0hvQSoyZO8pE8_HuJb-g/edit?usp=sharing

    also be sure to join the discord herehttps://discord.gg/d6yxPgC

    submitted by /u/Juicy451
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    AOE2 ELO Rating System explained

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 12:15 PM PDT

    AOE2 ELO Rating System explained

    For those of you wanting to know how the ELO system works inside AOE2 here is aa simple explanation.

    After a game your old ELO rating before the game (R1) will become your new ELO rating (R2) by applying this formula:

    R2 = R1 + K ( S - E )

    Where:

    - K is a constant that is equal to the max rating that you can win or lose in a single game (in the case
    of AOE2 K is = 32)

    - S is 1 for a win and 0 for a loss

    - E is the probability you have to win the game based on the two players rating before the game (if
    we are talking about player A and player B that is RA1 and RB1)

    but how do you calculate E

    Well, there is another formula for doing that, here is how it looks for player A (EA)

    EA =1 / ( 1 + 10 ^ ((RB1 - RA1) / 400))

    Let's do an example where player A has 1800 ELO points (RA1 = 1800) and player B has 1700 (RB1 = 1700)

    Player A probability to win the game according to the formula is 0.64

    EA = 1 / (1 + 10 ^ ((1700 - 1800) / 400))) = 1 / (1 + 10 ^ (-0.25)) = 1 / (1 + 0.56) = 1 / 1.56 = 0.64

    On the other hand, the calculated probability for player B to win the game is 0.36

    EB = 1 / (1 + 10 ^ ((1800 - 1700) / 400))) = 1 / (1 + 10 ^ (0.25)) = 1 / (1 + 1.78) = 1 / 2.78 = 0.36

    ​

    So, going back to our initial formula:

    R2 = R1 + K ( S - E )

    ​

    If player A wins the game (S=1) he will gain 11.52 ELO point which rounded is traduced into 12 points

    RA2 = RA1 + K ( S - EA ) = 1800 + 32 ( 1 - 0.64 ) = 1800 + 32 ( 0.36 ) = 1800 + 11.52 = 1811.52 == 1812

    and if he loses the game (S=0) he will lose 20.48 points rounded up to 20 points

    RA2 = RA1 + K ( S - EA ) = 1800 + 32 ( 0 - 0.64 ) = 1800 + 32 ( -0.64 ) = 1800 + (-20.48) = 1780.4 == 1780

    ​

    In the same way player B will win 20 points for winning the game or lose 12 points for losing

    RB2 = RB1 + K ( S - EB ) = 1700 + 32 ( 1 - 0.36 ) = 1700 + 32 ( 0.64 ) = 1700 + 20.48 = 1720.48 == 1720

    and if he loses the game (S=0) he will lose 11.52 points rounded up to 12 points instead.

    RB2 = RB1 + K ( S - EB ) = 1700 + 32 ( 0 - 0.36 ) = 1700 + 32 ( -0.36 ) = 1700 + (-11.52) = 1688.48 == 1688

    ​

    In the case of a game between two players with the same starting rate (lest say Player A has 1800 points and so does player B) then EA = 0.5 and EB = 0.5

    Then applying these formulas, the winner takes 16 points and the loser will lose the same 16 points which is half of the K value used in the formula.

    In AOE2, as the K value used is equal to 32 that is the biggest number of points that you can win or lose in a single game.

    Here is an example table of two players with different gap points between them and how much points they will gain or lose depending the result of the game

    ​

    https://preview.redd.it/1745q3j5xeh51.png?width=920&format=png&auto=webp&s=c4ff810426df5678d8470cd89cf23a2e4396cfd0

    submitted by /u/jv7030rd
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    Lets recommend eachother civilizations based on our play styles.

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 10:00 PM PDT

    Comment how you prefer to play, and maybe what civs you usually play, and then people can comment other civs that they think the poster would like.

    submitted by /u/SeaSquirrel
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    Wouldn't it be cool..

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 12:16 AM PDT

    If you could garrison soms units in outposts?

    It would make them a little more viable, to hide the composition of small armies.

    In addition..

    A new building, the Barn, which is a 2x3 lumber camp and mill combined, costs 150 wood and allows you to garrison HORSES inside. Epic right?

    submitted by /u/motonurse97
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    Question about Malians Arbs.

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 11:39 PM PDT

    Malians have arbs, but don't have bracer that real important upgrade for archer because of range.

    I saw Aztec use arbs that no thumb ring&ring archer ammor, and saw Kmer use them that no thumb ring. But I rare didn't see Malians Arbs.

    SO, I wonder, Are there any situation Malians need their Arbs although they don't have bracer?

    submitted by /u/dak0653
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    How to start playing team games

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 08:08 AM PDT

    Hi all, sorry for the throwaway but I don't want to have my game nick linked to my main account in case I share that information here.

    After more than 15 years I recently started playing again. I'm bad, really bad. Currently 630 ELO in 1v1 RM and 30% win rate (although only ~20 games), so I play mainly against AI.

    I would love to start and play some team games. My question is: ranked or unranked lobby? I tend towards ranked as I read that there are people who take a liking in demolishing noob lobbies. But I don't want to spoil the fun for my ranked teammates of the first matches until my tg ELO reaches my level. So, should I play ranked or unranked?

    submitted by /u/throwaway_aoe2
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    stuttering in multiplayer

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 08:05 AM PDT

    Playing DE with my buddie, against AI and in some games im experiencing stuttering every 30 seconds to a minute that last about 5-10 seconds, and sometimes the stutters will occur every 10 seconds lasting the same amount of time, im wondering if theres a fix that im just not seeing when i google around. Thank you!

    specs if neede - 2080 Super 16 GB ram and 3700x

    submitted by /u/TylerTR95
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    This is what it does, it appeals to like the male fantasy!

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 07:53 AM PDT

    Who has the best Battle Elephants?

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 08:29 PM PDT

    What civ do you think has the best Battle Elephants, and why? How would you rank them as well.

    View Poll

    submitted by /u/nikkythegreat
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    DM Rising Star 3!

    Posted: 16 Aug 2020 04:50 PM PDT

    DM Rising Star 3!

    ​

    https://preview.redd.it/rzkejl6fcgh51.png?width=1352&format=png&auto=webp&s=6c94abcd336734ab1803c4e107a0dd4943c8e845

    I am proud to announce the long overdue third installment of DM Rising Star! Five weeks of action beginning August 24th with a prize pool of $500+, we are excited to see who will be crowned the next DM Rising Star!
    The two previous DM Rising Star events featured two very different skill ranges; this year's event will involve players who have 1500- rating in both RM 1v1 and DM 1v1, along with 50+ games (ranked) on their account. In order for players to feel free to begin their journey in death match right away, we will enforce the rating caps to go by highest rating achieved on August 1st. We hope to see as many players signing up as possible; lets make this tournament one to remember!

    Promo Video (made by Brisolyn): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1I1IpyU1M6k

    Promo Video 2 (made by SpoolyGaming/KDanJuro): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_tK_ZQoHoU

    Sign-Up Page: https://www.aoezone.net/threads/sign-ups.168058/

    submitted by /u/p0nib0i
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    Game dropped to title screen?

    Posted: 17 Aug 2020 03:25 AM PDT

    This was the first time I ever experienced something like this.

    Mid game, dropped to title screen. Anyone else faced something like this?

    submitted by /u/Eggor
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