Age of Empires II Civilization Match-up Discussion Round 12 Week 1: Japanese vs Sicilians

Civilization Match-up Discussion Round 12 Week 1: Japanese vs Sicilians
BE GONE GOTH!
Best Onager shot in a REAL game so far!
Can we give mongol light cavalry +33% HP instead of +30%?
TheViper’s Nightbot: After an MRI of TheViper's wrist, it showed inflammation and a benign tumor and that is the reason why Viper's wrist been getting gradually worse the last 1,5 years. Surgery may be required, but it can also go away with taking care of the wrist. Doctor meeting soon to decide.
[OK] Was emblem of Ensemdle Studios about Dyson Sphere?
BacT vs Slam BO5 Showmatch!
Happy, but not like this
Unpopular Opinion: Lithuanians are worse to face than Franks
AoE2 inspired map in Rollercoaster Tycoon
My Elo graphs combined to form a godzilla
Is there a hidden favorite on Crater!?
Most OP strategies in 256x tech mod
i feel like a lot of my matches are won by chance 1000 elo ish
It's funny looking at the timeline as I get better and seeing how easy it is to read the pattern of the game on it. How do you think this game went, including army compositions at different times? I bet you can get it.
I need help modding strings!!
TheViper’s new single: Burgundians
Do you have a 1v1 RM ELO rating?
To everyone picking Burgandians on Arena
Video-Game Franchise Bracket - Let's go AoE!
Todd Masten made a masterpiece
New players communities?
I keep getting this on games I want to join, even if they aren’t full and green ping
Is it me or Lords of the West still doesn't have been on sale ?
Why do I get this error whenever I try to join a lobby? I get it for almost any lobby, but not for all.

Civilization Match-up Discussion Round 12 Week 1: Japanese vs Sicilians

Posted: 25 May 2021 08:19 PM PDT

Two very different approaches to "Infantry + Towers with a bit of Navy"

Hello and welcome back for another Age of Empires 2 civilization match up discussion! This is a series where we discuss the various advantages, disadvantages, and quirks found within the numerous match ups of the game. The goal is to collectively gain a deeper understanding of how two civilizations interact with each other in a variety of different settings. Feel free to ask questions, pose strategies, or provide insight on how the two civilizations in question interact with each other on any map type and game mode. This is not limited to 1v1 either. Feel free to discuss how the civilizations compare in team games as well! So long as you are talking about how the two civilizations interact, anything is fair game! Last week we discussed the Burmese vs Tatars, and next up is the Japanese vs Sicilians!

Japanese: Infantry^{and Naval} civilization

Fishing Ships 2x hp; +0/+2 armor; work +5/10/15/20% faster per Age
Mills, Lumber Camps, and Mining Camps cost -50%
Infantry attack +33% faster starting in Feudal Age
TEAM BONUS: Galleys +50% LoS
Unique Unit: Samurai (Fast-attacking infantry with bonus vs other UUs)
Castle Age Unique Tech: Yasama (Towers fire +2 additional arrows)
Imperial Age Unique Tech: Kataparuto (Trebuchets fire +33% faster; pack/unpack 4x faster)

Sicilians: Infantry civilization

Castles and Town Centers built +100% faster
Land units (except siege) receive -50% bonus damage
Farm upgrades provide +100% additional food
Can build Donjons starting in Feudal Age
TEAM BONOUS: Transport Ships +5 carry capacity; +10 anti-ship armor
Unique Unit: Serjeant (Heavy infantry that can build Donjons)
Unique Building: Donjon (Powerful, expensive Tower replacement that can fire multiple arrows)
Castle Age Unique Tech: First Crusade (Each TC (max. 5) instantly spawn 7 Serjeants; units more resistant to conversion)
Imperial Age Unique Tech: Scutage (Each team member receives 15g per military unit they own)

Below are some match up-specific talking points to get you all started. These are just to give people ideas, you do not need to address them specifically if you do not want to!

Alrighty, so this match up... is not one I think many people have played lol. For 1v1 Arabia, Japanese are very much a decent, if not quite exceptional, civ. Their early game can be deadly, and they have a solid tech tree, but the critically lack a lategame power unit or a midgame eco bonus. Sicilians, meanwhile, used to be a bit of a laughing stock, but did receive some fairly sizable buffs recently. Their Serjeants are now quite strong, their Donjons are more affordable, and their reduced bonus damage is always quite strong. Who do you favor on open maps here?
For closed maps, it's a bit of a similar story. Japanese have a broad tech tree, notably having Yasama towers to help out on the more closed-off maps, but still lack a long-term eco bonus or a super pop-efficient army. Sicilians now critically have access to Siege Onager, and their own midgame economy is not half bad with their super farms and quickly-built TCs. But how does this compare to the versatility of Japanese?
On full water maps, Japanese are always considered quite good, but not nearly as popular as Italians, Vikings, or Portuguese. They have a great fishing eco and early wood savings, but do miss a naval-specific military bonus. Sicilians, meanwhile, have very tanky transport ships to ensure landings (where Donjons can potentially be strong as well), but themselves lack a more direct navy bonus. However, it must be said that they insanely long-lasting farms can be quite good in stalemates... But which do you favor on Islands/Archipelago/Migration/etc.?

Thanks as always for participating! Next week we will continue our discussions with the Lithuanians vs Portuguese. Hope to see you there! :)

Previous discussions: Part 1 Part 2 Part 3

submitted by /u/OrnLu528
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BE GONE GOTH!

Posted: 26 May 2021 01:42 AM PDT

submitted by /u/Syryktam
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Best Onager shot in a REAL game so far!

Posted: 26 May 2021 02:52 AM PDT

submitted by /u/bestPlayer_xu
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Can we give mongol light cavalry +33% HP instead of +30%?

Posted: 25 May 2021 07:47 PM PDT

So light cav and hussars have 100 and 120 instead of 98 and 118 and my OCD can be at peace. That's all, thanks.

submitted by /u/TryHarderino
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TheViper’s Nightbot: After an MRI of TheViper's wrist, it showed inflammation and a benign tumor and that is the reason why Viper's wrist been getting gradually worse the last 1,5 years. Surgery may be required, but it can also go away with taking care of the wrist. Doctor meeting soon to decide.

Posted: 26 May 2021 05:37 AM PDT

This is a direct quote from his Twitch stream's Nightbot. Not speculation. :(

The game won't be the same if it can't be resolved. He'll be an awesome caster though.

submitted by /u/tiestofalljays
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[OK] Was emblem of Ensemdle Studios about Dyson Sphere?

Posted: 26 May 2021 02:01 AM PDT

submitted by /u/Funmer
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BacT vs Slam BO5 Showmatch!

Posted: 26 May 2021 06:55 AM PDT

submitted by /u/TTV-HelichaosAOE
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Happy, but not like this

Posted: 25 May 2021 04:48 PM PDT

submitted by /u/DeusVultGaming
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Posted: 25 May 2021 12:13 PM PDT

Everyone hates the amount of Franks pickers on the ladder (8% pick rate, 3% higher than any other civ) given how smooth their scouts into knights is with all their bonuses, but IMO Lithuanians are worse to face than Franks.

They have a a top 5 pick rate in less than <1650 elo game, and are 6th in pick rate >1650.

150 extra food gives them the smoothest dark age, allows them to go 17-18 pop scouts, do crazy early fishing on hybrid/water maps, allows them to go forward and lame without finding their own resources since they have a "longer clock" before their initial food/sheep run out

Their tech tree is probably the best in the game; full stable upgrades, they get crossbows with thumb ring and bracer, they have the best skirms in the game (FU, +10% speed, +2p/A) They have champ and halb, champs rarely ever come into play, and their halbs are basically FU with their UT, so they have Hussar/Skirm/Halb for post imp, only missing out on 1 melee armor for halbs.

Not to mention that their relic bonus comes into play far more often than the Franks + 12HP paladins, since getting an early faster working monastery they can easily outscale your knights within 2-3 minutes of hitting castle.

They don't really have a weak point like franks do, with Franks missing out on Bracer/archer armor, and having sub average light cav since they miss bloodlines. Lithuanians get pretty much everything, (they get all gunpowder units/buildings) and they excel at nearly all points in the game.

submitted by /u/DeusVultGaming
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AoE2 inspired map in Rollercoaster Tycoon

Posted: 26 May 2021 02:09 AM PDT

submitted by /u/Electro_Llama
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My Elo graphs combined to form a godzilla

Posted: 26 May 2021 12:20 AM PDT

https://preview.redd.it/hwroongm1f171.png?width=1258&format=png&auto=webp&s=7b54ea8acdfa1e4db8aedf181354edeae6fdc41c

submitted by /u/goko19
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Is there a hidden favorite on Crater!?

Posted: 26 May 2021 06:04 AM PDT

I got Crater now multiple time and always the opponent dodged it. But I have Arabia as map preference, so when I get Crater, then the opponent must have it marked as preference, right? So, why should he dodge it then!?

Happened already 4 or 5 times. Anyone else with this?

submitted by /u/Umdeuter
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Most OP strategies in 256x tech mod

Posted: 26 May 2021 04:21 AM PDT

Just played two games with 256x tech mod, and realized there are some seriously broken strategies haha

Magyars: Get to Feudal, build a Blacksmith, research Forging 256 times (Free and instant, increases cavalry attack +1), make Scouts. gg
Koreans: Get to Feudal, research archer armor techs 256 times (Free), run around with nearly invincible archers (unless they meet those Magyar Scouts!)
Malians: not really OP, but get to Feudal, research Gold Mining 30 times (Free and instant), run around the map stealing everyone's gold.

And of course we know about some of the OP strats that require Imperial Age (Torsion Engines becoming a nuclear warhead, for example), but you can't use that strategy if you're destroyed in Feudal. I ruined everything in a 4 player game with 19 vills and 4 scouts (had to replace the 4 scouts twice, but never rushed with more than 4, and never clicked up to Castle Age).

Any others you can think of?

submitted by /u/ShieldsCW
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i feel like a lot of my matches are won by chance 1000 elo ish

Posted: 26 May 2021 08:44 AM PDT

so in a recent match i decide to do a knight rush as celts. it HAPPENS to be that my enemy rushes with archers, so i win that engagement and kill the enemies base because my enemy picked the wrong unit. i really dont feel like my skill won me that. he rolled paper and i got scissors

submitted by /u/TheWarLoad
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It's funny looking at the timeline as I get better and seeing how easy it is to read the pattern of the game on it. How do you think this game went, including army compositions at different times? I bet you can get it.

Posted: 26 May 2021 02:35 AM PDT

submitted by /u/Snikhop
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I need help modding strings!!

Posted: 26 May 2021 07:34 AM PDT

I just can't get this piece of shit to work. Yes, the file is named and encoded correctly and it's in the correct folder, I checked if there are any quotation marks missing and there aren't. The weird thing is that midway through it worked for some time, but then when I added more strings, it again didn't.

This is the code:

8047 "Chemistry (projectiles +10 fire damage)"

28047 "Chemistry (<cost>) Projectiles cause +10 fire damage. Required forgunpowder units."

6288 "Konnik"

26288 "Konnik (<cost>) \nBulgarian unique cavalry unit that fights on as infantry when felled. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6290 "Elite Konnik"

26290 "Elite Konnik (<cost>) \nBulgarian unique cavalry unit that fights on as infantry when felled. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6111 "Throwing Axeman"

26111 "Throwing Axeman (<cost>) \nFrankish unique infantry unit with ranged melee attack. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6461 "Elite Throwing Axeman"

26461 "Elite Throwing Axeman (<cost>) \nFrankish unique infantry unit with ranged melee attack. Strong vs. infantry. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6447 "Boyar"

26447 "Boyar (<cost>) \nSlavic unique cavalry unit with high armor. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6449 "Elite Boyar"

26449 "Elite Boyar (<cost>) \nSlavic unique cavalry unit with high armor. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6140 "Gbeto"

26140 "Gbeto (<cost>) \nMalian unique infantry unit with ranged melee attack. Fast-moving. Strong vs. infantry. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6141 "Elite Gbeto"

26141 "Elite Gbeto (<cost>) \nMalian unique infantry unit with ranged melee attack. Fast-moving. Strong vs. infantry. Smashes through armor and partically ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6574 "Berserk"

26574 "Berserk (<cost>) \nViking unique infantry unit that slowly heals itself. Strong vs. infantry and siege weapons. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6576 "Elite Berserk"

26576 "Elite Berserk (<cost>) \nViking unique infantry unit that slowly heals itself. Strong vs. infantry and siege weapons. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6113 "Woad Raider"

26113 "Woad Raider (<cost>) \nCeltic unique infantry unit. Fast-moving. Strong vs. infantry and siege weapons. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

6463 "Elite Woad Raider"

26463 "Elite Woad Raider (<cost>) \nCeltic unique infantry unit. Fast-moving. Strong vs. infantry and siege weapons. Smashes through armor and partially ignores it.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

7999 "Heavy Pikeman"

8999 "Upgrade to Heavy Pikeman"

18999 "D"

28999 "Upgrade to Heavy Pikeman (<cost>) \nUpgrades your Pikemen and lets you create Heavy Pikemen, which are stronger."

17999 "Heavy Pikeman"

5998 "Fortification Builder"

6998 "Fortification Builder"

26998 "Fortification Builder (<cost>) \nInfantry with the ability to build forward fortifications.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

16998 "R"

5999 "Elite Fortification Builder"

6999 "Elite Fortification Builder"

26999 "Elite Fortification Builder (<cost>) \nInfantry with the ability to build forward fortifications.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

16999 "R"

5997 "Stationary Trebuchet"

6997 "Stationary Trebuchet"

26998 "Stationary Trebuchet (<cost>) \nStationary Trebuchet; unable to move. Build near enemy fortifications or behind your own walls.\n<hp> <attack> <armor> <piercearmor> <range>"

8327 "Warwolf (Trebs +5 range)"

28327 "Warwolf (<cost>) \nImproves your Trebuchets by giving them +5 range."

8310 "Timurid Siegecraft (Trebuchets +10 range, enables Flaming Camel)"

28310 "Research Timurid Siegecraft (<cost>) \nTrebuchets receive +10 range. Enables Flaming Camels."

8378 "Siege Engineers (siege +1 range, shoot 10% faster)"

28378 "Siege Engineers (<cost>) \nSiege weapons have +1 range and reload 10% faster."

8151 "Bracer (+1 range, 10% faster firing rate for all kinds of ranged units and buildings)"

28151 "Bracer (<cost>) \nAll kinds of ranged units and buildings get +1 range range (except gunpowder units) and fire 10% faster (except non arrow-firing units)."

8411 "Thumb Ring (arrow-firing units and buildings fire 20% faster )"

28411"Thumb Ring (<cost>) \nArrow-firing units and buildings fire 20% faster."

8278 "Arrowslits (buildings +1 attack, fire 10% faster, +2 projectiles [Castles +10])"

28278 "Arrowslits (<cost>) \nBuildings get +1 attack, fire 10% faster and get 2 more projectiles (Castles 10 more)"

8172 "Fletching (ranged units and buildings +1 range and attack [archers +10% attack]; projectiles +10% speed)"

28172 "Fletching (<cost>) \nRanged units and buildings get +1 range and attack (archers +10% attack) and projectiles move 10% faster. "

8150 "Research Bodkin Arrow (ranged units and buildings +1 range and +2 attack [archers +20% attack])"

28150 "Research Bodkin Arrow (<cost>) \nRanged units and buildings get +1 range and +2 attack (archers +20% attack)."

8067 "Forging (+2 melee attack)"

28067 "Forging (<cost>) \nInfantry and cavalry get +2 attack."

8068 "Iron Casting (+1 melee attack, 10% faster attack speed)"

28068 "Iron Casting (<cost>) \nInfantry and cavalry get +1 attack and attack 10% faster."

8075 "Blast Furnace (+2 melee attack, 10% faster attacking speed)"

28075 "Blast Furnace (<cost>) \nInfantry and cavalry get +2 attack and attack 10% faster."

submitted by /u/CT-6969_HentaiDealer
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TheViper’s new single: Burgundians

Posted: 26 May 2021 07:27 AM PDT

submitted by /u/tiestofalljays
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Do you have a 1v1 RM ELO rating?

Posted: 26 May 2021 06:34 AM PDT

Elo gets mentioned in this sub all the time but let's see what portion of the people here actually have it.

View Poll

submitted by /u/BBatMuddClubBER
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To everyone picking Burgandians on Arena

Posted: 25 May 2021 12:58 PM PDT

I hate you :'(

This tech srsly needs to go You just have no chance with cav civs At least make the fl militia bad against buildings Maybe for top players it is balanced but on lower than 1500 elo it's just stupidly strong

submitted by /u/strobowski
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Video-Game Franchise Bracket - Let's go AoE!

Posted: 26 May 2021 09:08 AM PDT

submitted by /u/Suleja21
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Todd Masten made a masterpiece

Posted: 26 May 2021 05:19 AM PDT